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Old 24-05-2016, 09:56 AM   #61
jonisdead
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Originally Posted by haze015 View Post
There's this wonderful thing called "null" testing. This isn't as subjective as you'd think.
I know what a null hypothesis is, my career is based around it. You're asserting now that the files are the same yet in a previous post you admitted there are differences, but to you they're difficult to describe "properly". Which is it, then? I think I know damn well the difference between a placebo effect and not, if the mix is flat then it's flat, if it's vibrant then it's vibrant. The sample clips sound almost entirely different from the files that I have, and it's silly to backtrack on your initial claim that it's "difficult" to articulate the sonic differences and say instead that there are no differences. I don't have to articulate them, the differences speak for themselves. The FLAC encoded file contains more musical information than the 320, and unless it really were an upcode (which it isn't) then I wouldn't be hearing any differences at all in my monitors or my headphones.
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Old 24-05-2016, 10:06 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by jonisdead View Post
I know what a null hypothesis is, my career is based around it. You're asserting now that the files are the same yet in a previous post you admitted there are differences, but to you they're difficult to describe "properly". Which is it, then? I think I know damn well the difference between a placebo effect and not, if the mix is flat then it's flat, if it's vibrant then it's vibrant. The sample clips sound almost entirely different from the files that I have, and it's silly to backtrack on your initial claim that it's "difficult" to articulate the sonic differences and say instead that there are no differences. I don't have to articulate them, the differences speak for themselves.
The mixes sound the same to me.

And null testing in audio is not null hypothesis, its just a simple method of showing two bits of audio are the same by them cancelling each other out when put out of phase with each other.

There's a difference between articulating the artefacts of mp3 compression and claiming a different mix altogether.

Considering my dissertation was on the affects of compression and to what extent its legitimately perceivable, I think I'm in a far better position to talk about placebos regarding audio. Psychoacoustics is a wonderful area and also quite scary how easy it is to fool the ears.
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Old 24-05-2016, 10:16 AM   #63
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It's amazing how some people believe that they're above placebo, which is exactly why placebo works.

Can you describe exactly what's different with the mix and in which song?
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Old 24-05-2016, 10:22 AM   #64
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It's amazing how some people believe that they're above placebo, which is exactly why placebo works.
My favourite forms of it are quite subtle. Like if you go to tune your guitar and pick the wrong string, as you expect to be tuning the one you're doing, you perceive the pitch as changing, but never right. Or having controls that do nothing for people who you don't want to change things, tell them its the control for whatever and they'll perceive it as doing that.

Its the whole basis of the audiophile industry.
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Old 24-05-2016, 10:28 AM   #65
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A bit unrelated but I used to have problems with the volume suddenly getting a bit lower, but it happened quite slowly, so whenever I said "THERE, NOW" to someone, they didn't notice it. But I could swear that it was, even though the volume control stayed the same. So I would have the raise the volume, but then after a while the volume would go back up just as much as it had gone down earlier, and all of the sudden the music was too loud. Still didn't show up in the volume control. I was going mad

Then I replaced the audio drivers, and after that I never had any problems. Placebo? Or was I just imagining the whole issue? I of course believe that I fixed the problem, but I could never prove to anyone else that it was happening
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Old 24-05-2016, 10:42 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by Tjet View Post
A bit unrelated but I used to have problems with the volume suddenly getting a bit lower, but it happened quite slowly, so whenever I said "THERE, NOW" to someone, they didn't notice it. But I could swear that it was, even though the volume control stayed the same. So I would have the raise the volume, but then after a while the volume would go back up just as much as it had gone down earlier, and all of the sudden the music was too loud. Still didn't show up in the volume control. I was going mad

Then I replaced the audio drivers, and after that I never had any problems. Placebo? Or was I just imagining the whole issue? I of course believe that I fixed the problem, but I could never prove to anyone else that it was happening
A couple of weeks ago my headphones started putting out sound through one channel with the laptop headphone out, so quickly hooked up to my interface and the headphones were fine, so back to the headphone out on the laptop and everything was fine.

Then there was issue of incoming audio into DAWs being 20db lower than they should be. It is like being gaslighted constantly with this stuff!

Could be worse though, could own vintage synthesisers


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Originally Posted by jonisdead View Post
The FLAC encoded file contains more musical information than the 320, and unless it really were an upcode (which it isn't) then I wouldn't be hearing any differences at all in my monitors or my headphones.
Didn't see this.

No it doesn't contain more "musical" information, just more data, some of which is debatably not perceivable due to particular psychoacoustic phenomenon, so lossy compression "removes" it. The more heavily, the more risk of audible artefacts.
Also I didn't say it was an upscale of a 320k mp3, the PCM data is available (A red book standard 16/44.1k CD, of which I own most on) and its easy to perform sample rate conversion with that and have something better than an mp3. You've claimed yourself you've not these albums in PCM format. You seem very confused about all these formats and also trying to claim things that I cannot replicate and not for lack of trying!
I'm comparing those clips to Spotify and the rips I have of the CDs, which were generally purchased when the albums were released using a MOTU Ultralite 3, KRK VXT6's and AKG K702's. Absolution here sounds no different to a rip of the CD with the incorrect track listing or Spotify streaming at 320k!

Any subtle change to any mix would still be noticeable, even with mp3. Any "colour" as a result of a format, digital or analogue, doesn't mean a different mix or master.
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Last edited by haze015; 24-05-2016 at 07:42 PM.
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Old 24-05-2016, 09:17 PM   #67
jonisdead
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Originally Posted by Tjet View Post
It's amazing how some people believe that they're above placebo, which is exactly why placebo works.

Can you describe exactly what's different with the mix and in which song?
I will based on the clips alone, the main differences I noticed months ago when I originally heard those clips as well as the ones I've noticed now were largely the same as well, and I picked up on a few other differences. I'll list them out when I'm done with this massive project
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Everything is so obvious!!!
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