2012 - The Future of Mankind

[Liz Savage]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8545585184878490822

The first ten minutes of this talk should be heard by all Americans.The speaker is Micheal Tsarion. This is absolutely fascinating.

[Ducky101]

Yay for links... :indiff: :happy:


*goes to watch*

[Ducky101]

* flops *

3 HOURS!
Hell no! lol :LOL:

(lol at Bush though. He talks utter poop in some of these clips.. but they're kinda biased..)

[Jakob Steen Madsen]

To those interested seriously in this 2012 topic, I suggest you take a trip down the following lane.

http://www.mayanmajix.com/

Ian bases his research on the book by Calleman, one of the key persons in recent Mayan alternative interpretations.


Enjoy.

[craigacp]

These people are servants of the Vatican, and agents of the British Royal family

Really now. I don't think that George Bush or his friends are working for the Pope or the Queen. Also the sheer amount of people who you could say were descended from a historical figure in 1099 must be in the millions.

I've watched the first 10 minutes of that. And the only thing that it makes me believe is that anyone who takes this even remotely seriously should be put in a padded room for the rest of their lives.

[Jakob Steen Madsen]

Sometimes its important to give such loosly slung statements a minute of thought before calling them downright wrong.

If the school football team can be said to serve the school and the school morale, then the same can be said about the individual players. If the cheerleaders are cheering the team they are now adopting this same function. If there are sponsors involved say in the paying of tuition for the star player, and this is to be considered an investment for said company for future pro football, then the potential payback on this investment is now actually assisted by everyone aiding the team, and thus suddenly the individual cheerleader, player, coach etc. is actually indirectly supporting the company commitng the "illegal" action of supporting non pro football.

The same can be said about the systems mentioned. The bank of england serves the nation of britain (to some extend), and the nation is the royal family (its symbol), so if the bank owns a major part in say microsoft, then indirectly people running this OS is supporting the Bank of England, the royal family, the britons, and so on and so forth.

There is no need for secret meetings and breathings in unison to bring forth a system of dependancies and relevance. These systems are hardwired into society, and just as we view a beehive as having a common intent and "mind", so we tend to do the same with our own humanmade systems. The documentary on "The Corporation" is another good example of this, it expose the problems with the legal construct of a corporation and its behavioral consequences. In short the minor greed of the single stockholder is refined into a monstrous and evil greedy behavior through the corridors of the corporate world. Personally I like the productiveness of the corporate system, and believe its needed to evolve our world, but I see the problem with the current legal construct. We need to revise a lot of the systems in our society today, because they need to serve a higher purpose in a more ethical world. I cant drink a cup of coffee that has 0.025% responsibility of someones death. In the past I was not aware of these problems due to blissfull ignorance, but in our higher informed world I cant use ignorance as an excuse.

[craigacp]

Sometimes its important to give such loosly slung statements a minute of thought before calling them downright wrong.

If the school football team can be said to serve the school and the school morale, then the same can be said about the individual players. If the cheerleaders are cheering the team they are now adopting this same function. If there are sponsors involved say in the paying of tuition for the star player, and this is to be considered an investment for said company for future pro football, then the potential payback on this investment is now actually assisted by everyone aiding the team, and thus suddenly the individual cheerleader, player, coach etc. is actually indirectly supporting the company commitng the "illegal" action of supporting non pro football.

The same can be said about the systems mentioned. The bank of england serves the nation of britain (to some extend), and the nation is the royal family (its symbol), so if the bank owns a major part in say microsoft, then indirectly people running this OS is supporting the Bank of England, the royal family, the britons, and so on and so forth.


No. Just no.

[Jakob Steen Madsen]

Strong argument if ever I saw one.. :)

Would you mind elaborating just a little?

[craigacp]

Strong argument if ever I saw one.. :)

Would you mind elaborating just a little?

Well, not really, because the whole premise of your argument is tenuous, and I don't have all day.

With your example with the Bank of England and Microsoft, its hardly a fair comparison to what the guy was saying. He was saying that Bush was a puppet of the Royal family, because he was a descendent of a twelfth century nobleman. Which is utter bollocks.

[Static Shadows]

He was saying that Bush was a puppet of the Royal family, because he was a descendent of a twelfth century nobleman.

:LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

That's got to be the funniest thing i've heard all day!

They don't really have any say in the running of government in England but they have Dubbya in their pockets. It's because in reality they're all giant lizards in disguise don't ya know. ;)

Some intersting thoughts on corporations above tho. Yes, you could examine what percent of your actions are resulting in someones death for any small action (butterfly effect is an interesting parrellel here) but (as Hume said in relation to analysing everything so closely - i.e. there's no guarentee the sun will rise tommorow, just a very high probability) you just can't live your life like that.

Although i do hate corporations

EDIT: And no, the nation of Britain is not the royal family in any significant way. Not even symbolically and certainly not socaily.
I spend my life in Britian thinking about the royal family as often as i spend it saying 'tally ho me old fruit what what?'

[Jakob Steen Madsen]

Tsarion is rather good at presenting other peoples material and adding his own spin on much of it. The problem is on some rather important parts he is just so far off the mark, especially his etymology is so seriously flawed that people with the slightest knowledge in the field can catch him grasping for something fitting his theories.

He has some remarkable comments when it comes to psychology though imo, his claims about human phobias being linked to large physical trauma commited against the race is intriuging. He has to much the "Icke" spin though in some areas, and his atlantean storyteller-mode is undermining his message imo.

[Wendigo]

"I spend my life in Britian thinking about the royal family as often as i spend it saying 'tally ho me old fruit what what?'"



That....is among the best things I've ever read.....anywhere.Ever. THANK YOU.

[Static Shadows]

"I spend my life in Britian thinking about the royal family as often as i spend it saying 'tally ho me old fruit what what?'"



That....is among the best things I've ever read.....anywhere.Ever. THANK YOU.

Your welcome. Have a biscuit (http://tkfiles.storage.msn.com/x1pN1mp8dKYgTFEWi0OAw14Yh4lY0ds-s0Q5asqNBxB9ByXUXOAswUynlYBX337ygOdgOI1uW876aaFjXS DQPaEZSEGUnamL1sf1otFsw9qOFBbK0rhxA-UHQ). :D

[Iggy Stardust]

No. Just no.

Your belief system will be your downfall, Im telling you. You're full of fear.

[craigacp]

Your belief system will be your downfall, Im telling you. You're full of fear.


No. I'm full of cynicism, sarcasm and bitterness.

Fear doesn't figure in my mental landscape (with a few exceptions).

[Iggy Stardust]

Fear doesn't figure in my mental landscape (with a few exceptions).

No. Just no.

[Niall]

Muse have a deal with Warner Bros. Warner Bros. provide the USA with entertainment, and the nation of George Bush (it's President), so if Muse hate George Bush, so does Warner Bros., as does the USA, as does George Bush.

Flawless logic through and through. It just doesn't work like that. The parts are too loosely connected, variable and seperated for any so directly causual to happen as the given Royal Family -> Microsoft thing. There's no discrete relationship between the parts. The team ethos might be to serve the school, but that doesn't dictate the minds and opinions of every player and cheerleader unless you can say exactly why.

[ZombieEaten]

Muse's web site and this board run on servers managed by a company called Akamai. Akamai also runs the FBI and Whitehouse.gov and other political web sites.

Oh, and Akamai's cofounder and CTO was in first class on flight 11, he served in Israeli special forces before becoming a billionaire in the dot com era.

[craigacp]

No. Just no.

Ahh the joys of arguments. Couldn't you have at least come up with your own refuting statement rather than borrowing mine?

[SilentGod]

This all seems like reverse science. We have the idea, now find some damn correlation!

[SilentGod]

I've watched the first 10 minutes of that. And the only thing that it makes me believe is that anyone who takes this even remotely seriously should be put in a padded room for the rest of their lives.

Brilliant!

[Iggy Stardust]

Ahh the joys of arguments. Couldn't you have at least come up with your own refuting statement rather than borrowing mine?


No. Just no.

[craigacp]

No. Just no.

Say it another 3 or 4 times and it might become funny again.

[Sleepy]

Anyone who is interested in the 2012 theory should really check out Mr. Terence McKenna. Very interesting stuff.

[GorkerMorker]

Visit who what? I only found some where maya site.

[Grey_Blot]

I prefer to think that Bush is a puppet for Big Oil.

Those looking for information will find that, if a corporation can gain Dick Cheney's favor, then it is easier to get the approval of Bush and Condi Rice.

That's why I tell my fellow citzens to hate Dick Cheney more than they hate Bush. Dick Cheney truly is a dick. I also say that Bush shouldn't be impeached for the simple reason that Dick Cheney is next in line.
+++++++++++++++++++++++
For a starting point on the 2012 apocalypse theory, perhaps it would be best to visit Wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012#Apocalyptic_beliefs_about_2012

[garseys]

The 2012 theory sounds interesting and a lot of prophetic people all link something drastic to happen in that year,but in honesty i think it is as beleivable as the 6/6/6 prophecies

[GorkerMorker]

Of course 'something' drastically will happen that year, like any other years to come. In 2012 all the prophets will take the most drastically thing happened in that year and put it out as 'proof' that their predictions where right.

Oil prices keep rising, tensions keep escalating, well of course some things will happen around that time!

[Grey_Blot]

Of course 'something' drastically will happen that year, like any other years to come. In 2012 all the prophets will take the most drastically thing happened in that year and put it out as 'proof' that their predictions where right.

Oil prices keep rising, tensions keep escalating, well of course some things will happen around that time!

Were there not tensions among humans before we discovered how to use oil?


But, I agree that there is nothing to get excited about.

I don't rightly care for all that hype over whether or not people think something 'big' is going to happen.
All throughout history people have made themselves feel special by claiming that they are living in 'the end of times'. And we are here, so obviously they were wrong.

For example, when we (people in general) were younger, there was that whole Y2K thing, which sent a few more people than I cared to see off in some silly panic. The much younger version of me was unknowingly excerising my rational thought by pondering something like this: "We can't all possibly die just because some computers go crazy. Why can't we just unplug them or take out the batteries and then recycle them to make new technology so that it won't freak out? Humans don't depend THAT much on a computer chip do they?" And, oh my, I was right! We didn't die, and the world did not end.

[craigacp]

Were there not tensions among humans before we discovered how to use oil?


But, I agree that there is nothing to get excited about.

I don't rightly care for all that hype over whether or not people think something 'big' is going to happen.
All throughout history people have made themselves feel special by claiming that they are living in 'the end of times'. And we are here, so obviously they were wrong.

For example, when we (people in general) were younger, there was that whole Y2K thing, which sent a few more people than I cared to see off in some silly panic. The much younger version of me was unknowingly excerising my rational thought by pondering something like this: "We can't all possibly die just because some computers go crazy. Why can't we just unplug them or take out the batteries and then recycle them to make new technology so that it won't freak out? Humans don't depend THAT much on a computer chip do they?" And, oh my, I was right! We didn't die, and the world did not end.


The Y2K thing if it had happened would have been a massive deal. Country wide power blackouts, transport failings, and telecommunications breaking down could have caused any number of problems in the developed world. The rest of the world would have been fine, but our civilisation may well have gone.

[GorkerMorker]

Were there not tensions among humans before we discovered how to use oil?


Whole civillisations have been build on oil. Fertilizers, medicines, energy, transportation, all the synthetics. I'm talking about super powers with immense weapons that rely on the oil. Within 40 years it's gone (of course not entirely, but the oil reserves only need a 10% drop to cause insane panic).

The society we live in today wouldn't exist, and can't exist without oil. It's different then some old computers that could break down because of some clock.

[murf27]

Your belief system will be your downfall, Im telling you. You're full of fear.

Can anyone enlighten me on how Mr. Stardust happened to get banned?

[Rhymes with Booze]

The 2012 theory sounds interesting and a lot of prophetic people all link something drastic to happen in that year,but in honesty i think it is as beleivable as the 6/6/6 prophecies

That and everyone KNOWS it all happens in 2025/26 anyway.

Can anyone enlighten me on how Mr. Stardust happened to get banned?

That's what I'm tripping on.

*researches most recent activity*

[Rhymes with Booze]

Ok, I just realised this is a zombie thread. *loses interest*

[Strawberry_Juice]

DAMMIT I thought Iggy had come back to resurrect one of his old threads!
Fuck you, getting me all excited for nothing. :indiff:

[Fumbles McStupid]

Can anyone enlighten me on how Mr. Stardust happened to get banned?

9/11 thread, one of mattw's earlier aliases

[Rhymes with Booze]

9/11 thread, one of mattw's earlier aliases

Oh, was that him?

[Strawberry_Juice]

Oui, he has had MANY lives on here.
Why I keep calling him Iggy. For some reason his Iggy Stardust phase was the most memorable...

[Rhymes with Booze]

Oui, he has had MANY lives on here.
Why I keep calling him Iggy. For some reason his Iggy Stardust phase was the most memorable...

Either I wasn't on here yet or I wasn't as involved as I am now. :( Missed it.

[ZombieEaten]

I miss Iggy too

[Amii]

Is the world really going to end on December 21 2012? The short answer is most likely no. We as human beings have no possible way of knowing when and how our planet will end. However, we are smart enough and intuitive enough to know when sure and imminent danger is near, and we must be willing to recognize and react to signs of coming change. More importantly we must realize that our entire universe along with our very existence runs in cycles, and evidence of these cycles has been scientifically proven and their recurrence is inevitable. Based on my research and studies into the many theories, prophecies, predictions and facts surrounding 2012, I have come to realize that our world is not set to completely end anytime soon. However, we can be certain that some very dramatic and devastating changes are coming, and these changes will most definitely represent the end of the world “AS WE KNOW IT”.

We are currently and unquestionably immersed in the final years of a thirteen-year global tribulation that began on the winter solstice 1999 and will reach its ultimate conclusion on December 21 2012. During this period of unrest and uncertainty we will become witnesses to a gathering storm of events that will slowly and systematically redefine our existence on this planet. These events will come in the form of both natural and manmade disasters as well as social, economic and religious upheavals, and will most definitely effect every living being on the planet. When featured on the local, network and cable news outlets, these events will be described in terms such as “never before seen”, “worst on record”, “apocalyptic” and yes, “the end of the world”.

As the days continue to countdown to Dec. 21 2012, we will begin to experience a number of natural disasters and unprecedented weather events such as earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, hurricanes, tsunamis, floods, droughts and many other extraordinary life threatening natural events. Although our planet has always experienced nature’s destructive wrath in one form or another, these disasters will become increasingly more frequent and significantly more intense then any we have ever experienced. Along with the increased property damage and economic losses associated with these disasters, the lose of human life will increase exponentially. As these extreme weather events continue to develop, they will help to significantly increase global famine, disease, pandemics and many other forms of human suffering. Massive floods will devastate, extreme heat will decimate and intense fires will incinerate the very ground on which we stand. Tornadoes will strike in uncommon places and at uncommon times of the year. Severe thunderstorms with intense lighting and uncommonly strong winds will become more prevalent, and the earth will rumble with unusual and unidentifiable sounds of stress.

In addition to natural disasters, mankind itself will initiate its own near destruction through the use of social, economic, chemical, biological and nuclear warfare. In a push for power and global domination you will begin to see the world governments respond to perceived threats from other nations with unprecedented force and extreme violence. This continuing show of force will undoubtably lead to a third world war and sure nuclear destruction of many highly populated regions. Many wars will be waged in the name of religion and ethnic cleansing, while others will be initiated to spawn a perceived one-world government to oversee a desired new world order. We will continue to be subjected to both petty and potentially life-altering laws, rules, regulations and religious initiatives designs to keep us preoccupied with day-to-day social, economic and health related issues. Our continuing insecurities will be intensified by an unscrupulous power base of leaders whose primary goal is to deliberately instill near chaos in the form of social and economic unrest. This continuing unrest will be artificially and irrevocably addressed through the implementation of ever increasing taxes, diminished human rights and a desire to keep us in perpetual debt and in a constant state of insured domestic poverty an insecurity.

All of the life threatening, human suffering and earth changing events that are and will continue to take place throughout the tribulation are simply a prelude to a much larger human and planetary disaster. These events in their entirety should and will serve as a preemptive warning of a single global catastrophic event expected to take place at exactly 11:11 GMT on December 21 2012. Science has made reference to a number of possible devastating earthly events such as a Yellowstone super volcanic eruption or a polar shift that could take place in a matter of moments. Other dangers from the sky such as enormous asteroids, increased and violent solar activity, the emergence of Planet X or Nibiru, and the possible devastating effects of a planetary alignment have been well documented and studied by scientists around the world. All of these scenarios have been proven viable and very relevant to the times in which we live. Any one of these events or a combination of many would bring unprecedented global destruction. Human life would dramatically be effected and millions, even billions will die. Although no one knows exactly what this coming catastrophe might bring, we can be sure that the outcome will be dire.

The coming global cataclysm is in no way unique to our existence on this earth. As part of a universal cycle of near destruction, our planet and its population has experienced some form of renewal many times before, and it appears we are in line to witness this extraordinary event once again. The coming event is very real and has been foreseen and foretold by most all ancient civilizations and religions throughout the world. Although the basic scenarios and possible implications very, the final outcome remains consistent in all cases. The ancient Mayans and Aztecs refer to this coming event in terms such as the entering of the fifth world or fifth sun. The Hopi Indians call it the great purification. Christianity calls it the Rapture. Islam sees it as the coming of the Mahdi. The Hindus believe we are in the final moments of the Iron Age, which is the last of four periods known as Kali Yuga. Astrologers call it the coming of the Age of Aquarius which is representative of a cleansing of the earth. In addition, interpretations of many ancient and modern day oracles and prophets of doom also see the coming events. The Chinese book of Changes (I-Ching) sees it as the end of history. The Bible Code, The Web Bot Project, Nostradamus and many others also have provided us with the necessary signs of coming devastation. NASA has confirmed increasing solar disturbances that will reach their peek in late 2012, and even Albert Einstein spoke about the possible implications of the coming astronomical anomalies.

We as human beings are instinctually aware of the coming changes. If you haven’t already began to experience it, very soon you, as an individual will begin to notice an increased sense of awareness and understanding of the inevitable. Many attribute this increased awareness to a possible chemical enhancement of human DNA, while other believe these abilities have simply been suppressed and denied over time and are slowly being revealed in order to prepare us for sure and sustainable change. These feeling and signs of utter dread and impending doom will begin to manifest themselves in many ways, and will effect an ever increasing number of people as we get closer to December 21 2012. Some will see this as a spiritual awakening, while other will experience a remarkable ability to foresee coming events through dreams, meditation, moments of déjà vu and gut Instinct. Your individual increased perceptions will be small an insignificant at first and will be dismissed as coincidence or chance. You may for example have a passing thought about an old friend, and that person will contact you. You may briefly think about a song from your past, and that song will play on the radio. You may experience an increased ability to associate particular smells with past events, and many will see a significant reoccurrence of the numbers11:11. As these events become increasingly more common and more relevant, you will come to realize their importance to coming events.
Our political systems have become increasingly more corrupt and self-serving, and people are suffering and dying in unimaginable ways. I encourage you to step back and look beyond your own personal problems and situations and realize that we exist not as individuals, but as a worldwide community who shares one single planet that is in chaos.





Just read that on some 2012 website. Not one to believe in all this shit but if that's what's coming to us then FARRRK.

Here's hoping it's just a load of bollocks, which it probably is. How many other large scale doomsday predictions have there been that have turned out to be rubbish?
(I deleted loads off the end as my message exceeded 11000 characters. :LOL:)

[Megglen]

*hides* I DON'T WANT TO DIE AT 18!

[Mozza]

In the unlikely event it is true, you wont be able to do anything about it so I wouldn't worry.

Also, how exactly will earthquakes and volcanoes be triggered? Thats quite a bold statement to make.

[GorkerMorker]

Yeah how likely is it that a misinterpretation of a Mayan calendar can come true?:facepalm:

[Ril]

Nostradamus will be a bit peeved. He still has another 1000 years of predictions to come true.

[Mozza]

Nostradamus will be a bit peeved. He still has another 1000 years of predictions to come true.

We fucked him over by changing the calendar :chuckle:

[GorkerMorker]

Nostradamus will be a bit peeved. He still has another 1000 years of predictions to come true.

That's fucking hilarious actually, making predictions up to the year 3700 only to predict everything ends halfway.

[Mozza]

That's fucking hilarious actually, making predictions up to the year 3700 only to predict everything ends halfway.

:LOL:

People believe it though

[LiT]

Two words for 2012: Nibiru, Annunaki

[Peroxide Pixie]

In the unlikely event it is true, you wont be able to do anything about it so I wouldn't worry.

Also, how exactly will earthquakes and volcanoes be triggered? Thats quite a bold statement to make.

I've read quite a bit of info about it, they believe that because the next magnetic pole shift/reversal is due at the end 2012 this could mean disasters could occur. If you look up magnetic pole shift/reversal there is loads of info on the internet about it.

Some non conspiracy information about flips can be found here...

http://www.geomag.bgs.ac.uk/reversals.html

[egomaniac]

I've read quite a bit of info about it, they believe that because the next magnetic pole shift/reversal is due at the end 2012 this could mean disasters could occur. If you look up magnetic pole shift/reversal there is loads of info on the internet about it.

Some non conspiracy information about flips can be found here...

http://www.geomag.bgs.ac.uk/reversals.html

Thank you, I'm not interested in the whole conspiracy doomsday crap, but I really believe they have got it right and some pretty bad shit will happen with the weather. People are goooooona die

[Mozza]

I don't believe in doomsday stuff, but I do think a problem such as climate change or malthus' theory could cause some serious problems for our societies.

[GorkerMorker]

No doubt bad stuff is going to happen to the weather and people are going to die. Just not because of a pole shift, it will be because of us.

[Mozza]

No doubt bad stuff is going to happen to the weather and people are going to die. Just not because of a pole shift, it will be because of us.

I did find it odd people tried to claim the green revolution proved Malthus wrong. If the sea levels do indeed rise and desertification continues to occur no amount of innovation in agriculture will prevent the wars, famine and diseases that will inevitably occur.

Even without climate change, the population growth in places in Africa and South Asia are unsustainable.

[Caff]

Yeah how likely is it that a misinterpretation of a Mayan calendar can come true?:facepalm:

I'm seriously going to lose my shit in 2012 with all the fools I'm going to have to correct ALL YEAR. :facepalm:

[Peroxide Pixie]

I'm seriously going to lose my shit in 2012 with all the fools I'm going to have to correct ALL YEAR. :facepalm:

Don't start until 2013, remember it's all suppose to begin at the end of December 2012 and continue through the year ;)

[GorkerMorker]

Ah yes of course, let's postpone the whole thing one year further.

They'll just pick the biggest disaster out of those two years and say that the Mayans meant that.

[Problemfanatique]

Well, if this is true, there's nothing we can do. We might as well not worry and make the most of our lives.

[Caff]

Ah yes of course, let's postpone the whole thing one year further.

They'll just pick the biggest disaster out of those two years and say that the Mayans meant that.

Probably. Some people are just so determined to prove the supernatural they'll do dumb stuff like that.

Because picking random dates to fit in with your own agenda when those dates contradict the calendar itself is obviously scientifically sound :LOL:

[shadowkay]

I've read quite a bit of info about it, they believe that because the next magnetic pole shift/reversal is due at the end 2012 this could mean disasters could occur. If you look up magnetic pole shift/reversal there is loads of info on the internet about it.

Some non conspiracy information about flips can be found here...

http://www.geomag.bgs.ac.uk/reversals.html
thats happened many times before and it didn't wipe life out,

[Peroxide Pixie]

thats happened many times before and it didn't wipe life out,

Hence me putting the non consiracy take on it in the link :)

Also many consiracy theories don't include life being wiped out just that it will change.

[Caff]

Also I did a lot about Malthus during my first year of my BA because with me doing medieval economic and social history there were quite a lot of faminies and of course the Black Death/plague. My memory is a little hazy but I'm sure Malthus was basically saying that population change is in a cycle and it has to be reduced every once in a while but it will always rise again only to be cut again eventually. Obviously he was writing at a time when this pattern was accepted as pretty normal but now we like to think we can stop it from happening as we like to think we've forced to earth to sustain us.

Anyway, what I mean is...if Malthus was indeed right then we're long overdue a massive cull of the population and in that case there's probably no point worrying because we'll no doubt have brought it on ourselves. Not that I want to die of course and hope that it doesn't happen.

[shadowkay]

Hence me putting the non consiracy take on it in the link :)

Also many consiracy theories don't include life being wiped out just that it will change.
but how can it be a conspiracy, its a natural phenomenon.

[Peroxide Pixie]

but how can it be a conspiracy, its a natural phenomenon.

True but these theories are tied in with 2012/ancient calendars etc etc, that we will evolve after 2012 or reach a higher state of consciousness, it's just stuff I've read about not stuff I believe so sorry if I'm being vague.

[Caff]

Well Big Brother is ending in the UK next year so that should force a good few million people to do a bit of evolving at least.

[Strawberry_Juice]

I'm predicting at least two group suicides of people who sincerely believe it's the end.

[Black Mamba]

Well Big Brother is ending in the UK next year so that should force a good few million people to do a bit of evolving at least.
LOL

[Sir Quinton]

thats happened many times before and it didn't wipe life out,

It'd have a pretty major impact on human population when it happens. Birds and bees and IIRC insects all use Earth's magnetic field to navigate. Without it they'll soon die out or populations will go into sharp decline and we're currently dependent on them to polinate food crops. 2012 is bollocks though.

[Novus Dies]

No. I'm full of cynicism, sarcasm and bitterness.

Fear doesn't figure in my mental landscape (with a few exceptions).

Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering

fear is the path to the dark side.


http://www.code7r.org/inquiz/0502/images/yoda4.jpg

[Novus Dies]

Well Big Brother is ending in the UK next year so that should force a good few million people to do a bit of evolving at least.

Is it? THANK FUCK. If it really is they'll have some new show in 2011 which will SUCK and fail more than BB4.

[Caff]

Is it? THANK FUCK. If it really is they'll have some new show in 2011 which will SUCK and fail more than BB4.

It has definitely been cancelled after next year.

So hopefully everyone who is stupid enough to enjoy it will grow back a few braincells and I won't have to put up with seeing some nobody from the house taking her clothes off all over the magazines.

[Ril]

Of course we're also forgetting that meteor that's gonna hit us in 2027 too.

[Novus Dies]

It has definitely been cancelled after next year.

So hopefully everyone who is stupid enough to enjoy it will grow back a few braincells and I won't have to put up with seeing some nobody from the house taking her clothes off all over the magazines.

Well it did get shit ratings, better die than keep milking it like Xfactor and BGT.

[Caff]

Of course we're also forgetting that meteor that's gonna hit us in 2027 too.

Not to mention that we're apparently orbiting a series of black holes?

[QueenOfNerds]

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/10/23/

Asteriods are always a worry, just look at Jupiter! we didn't know about that till the new spot was seen :stunned:

[Ril]

Not to mention that we're apparently orbiting a series of black holes?

Oh I'll have to update my records, I thought there was only one black hole for every solar system!

I've actually read lately that some people reckon they can actually see Planet X in the sky and have photos that 'prooove' it. Even one saying it's on Google Earth! Bring on this 2012 age of enlightenment I say! :facepalm:

Ooh it just started thundering, must be a sign.

[Caff]

If we do get hit by something I hope it hits us in a way that makes it a quick death :LOL:

[Strawberry_Juice]

If we do get hit by something I hope it hits us in a way that makes it a quick death :LOL:
Yeah, I'd much rather be killed immediately at the site of the impact than burn to death and feel my lungs and skin shrivel away.

[Caff]

Oh I'll have to update my records, I thought there was only one black hole for every solar system!

I've actually read lately that some people reckon they can actually see Planet X in the sky and have photos that 'prooove' it. Even one saying it's on Google Earth! Bring on this 2012 age of enlightenment I say! :facepalm:

Ooh it just started thundering, must be a sign.

I actually can't remember. Not being an actual astro-physicist most of my reading has just been general interest and I swear I've read the single black hole theory but I also saw something that says our solar system is about to pass through a minefield of black holes. Can't remember the sources so for all I know it could've been a load of paranoid unscientific shit.

[Ril]

Haha I have no idea either, that was just the latest conspiracy theory I read! :LOL:

[Novus Dies]

You know debris is all over the solar system, we would be lucky to see a earth totaling rock but it would happen so fast we would never find out, just ''boom'' and we're all dead. Plus we can't see most of them very well and they're moving so any telescopes would be lucky to spot them....

I sometimes sit and wonder if it's about to happen, quite freaky.

It wouldn't be like Armageddon, yea, shit cheezy film but you get my point.

The atmosphere would get to several thousand degrees in a few milliseconds from the pressure.

[shadowkay]

It'd have a pretty major impact on human population when it happens. Birds and bees and IIRC insects all use Earth's magnetic field to navigate. Without it they'll soon die out or populations will go into sharp decline and we're currently dependent on them to polinate food crops. 2012 is bollocks though.
Bee's use the sun's position to work out direction of that I'm pretty sure, most insects rely on the pheromone trail of scouts to navigate, and I believe migratory birds now use human landmarks on their travels. Also the shift is not instantaneous, there is evidence to suggest that it has already started, looking the polar shift from Canada across to Siberia.

It was about 7 years ago that I studied this so I'm probably wrong, but the major effect would be on human technology that relies on north being north, so it'll be a problem for planes and boats, but with modern gps technology it should be a non issue.

I think at least....

[Sir Quinton]

Bee's use the sun's position to work out direction of that I'm pretty sure, most insects rely on the pheromone trail of scouts to navigate, and I believe migratory birds now use human landmarks on their travels. Also the shift is not instantaneous, there is evidence to suggest that it has already started, looking the polar shift from Canada across to Siberia.

It was about 7 years ago that I studied this so I'm probably wrong, but the major effect would be on human technology that relies on north being north, so it'll be a problem for planes and boats, but with modern gps technology it should be a non issue.

I think at least....

Ahh, I'm going off some documentary I saw when I was about seven on homing pigeons seeing ultraviolet purple spots where magnetic north lies. Could easilly have been a dream. :LOL:

Can't get my head around the Sun thing, unless they have a way of measuring time and accouting for the movement of the sun in between aswel tas their relative movement, though I guess on short flights it's not going to make much difference.

Though a quick google returned this that suggests almost every animal relies on it for memory and navigation, which seems a bit far fetched: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Earth-039-s-Magnetism-and-Life-49050.shtml

[shadowkay]

Ahh, I'm going off some documentary I saw when I was about seven on homing pigeons seeing ultraviolet purple spots where magnetic north lies. Could easilly have been a dream. :LOL:

Can't get my head around the Sun thing, unless they have a way of measuring time and accouting for the movement of the sun in between aswel tas their relative movement, though I guess on short flights it's not going to make much difference.

Though a quick google returned this that suggests almost every animal relies on it for memory and navigation, which seems a bit far fetched: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Earth-039-s-Magnetism-and-Life-49050.shtml
Hmm, that could have been a dream, the only way that I can think for that to occur is if there is a reaction between the magnetic field and the earths surface at point of contact that gives off ultraviolet energy, which then leads me to think that this point would be far too far north for birds to see it on their migratory paths.

Bee's use the sun as a reference point in the waggle dance, and they are able to work out its position at night to rely directions, I don't know how they keep the time to be able to do this, but I imagine it will be through a similar method to animals tracking the mating season.

I'm not sure what to make of the article, it seems to make sense for underwater critters as in most of their cases there is no light, and turtles are able to use the same breeding site generation after generation, but the land and airborne creatures have have either a massive increase or an undisclosed reduction in magnetic field in their immediate area, however, animals are often fitted with tracking devices that emit electromagnetic waves which seem to have no effect on the organisms, and add to that all of mankinds electrical devices which doesn't seem to effect all the rats etc that live among us

edit: It turns out salmon have minute particles of iron in their brain

[QueenOfNerds]

Yeah, I'd much rather be killed immediately at the site of the impact than burn to death and feel my lungs and skin shrivel away.

Yes I would prefer to be squished please. Would be quicker and you would get quite a cool view too.

[Mozza]

Also I did a lot about Malthus during my first year of my BA because with me doing medieval economic and social history there were quite a lot of faminies and of course the Black Death/plague. My memory is a little hazy but I'm sure Malthus was basically saying that population change is in a cycle and it has to be reduced every once in a while but it will always rise again only to be cut again eventually. Obviously he was writing at a time when this pattern was accepted as pretty normal but now we like to think we can stop it from happening as we like to think we've forced to earth to sustain us.

Anyway, what I mean is...if Malthus was indeed right then we're long overdue a massive cull of the population and in that case there's probably no point worrying because we'll no doubt have brought it on ourselves. Not that I want to die of course and hope that it doesn't happen.

Yeah basically the gist of it is that population grows exponentially, food production grows arithmetically and land is finite. Although they have manged to increase food production exponentially in the short run, available land (and water) is still finite so something has to give eventually. Its not just famine or disease, its also war that will occur as countries/people scramble for the remaining food/land available. Arguably we are already seeing this with oil.

[GorkerMorker]

True but these theories are tied in with 2012/ancient calendars etc etc, that we will evolve after 2012 or reach a higher state of consciousness, it's just stuff I've read about not stuff I believe so sorry if I'm being vague.

Why is this sort of junk-science so much more popular then proper science? That's what I'd like to know.


'Evolve after 2012'? Whoever thought that up has been playing way too much pokémon.

[Wendigo]

Why is this sort of junk-science so much more popular then proper science? That's what I'd like to know.


'Evolve after 2012'? Whoever thought that up has been playing way too much pokémon.

Maybe it's the underdog/conspiracy aspect that goes along with "junk-science". i.e."The scientific mainstream denies we exist, and the government doesn't want you to know the truth" or variations on that theme. Plus it seems like a lot of the theories are scoffed at rather than explained away, so maybe sometimes people go with whoever speaks in a more agreeable way.

[shadowkay]

Why is this sort of junk-science so much more popular then proper science? That's what I'd like to know.


'Evolve after 2012'? Whoever thought that up has been playing way too much pokémon.
it's coffee table, people are more attracted to easy studies with no real implication

[GorkerMorker]

:stunned: I think you just hit the nail on the head.

Though I do find the 'scoffed at rather than explained away' rather curious. That's a really skewed idea of burden of proof.

it's coffee table, people are more attracted to easy studies with no real implication

Yeah, which is sad as there's some truly fascinating and weird shit to talk about that actually IS the product of real science and not someone's imagination. I sometimes feel for these people as they're missing out on allot by wasting their time with fiction and pretend it's fact.

[Wendigo]

:stunned: I think you just hit the nail on the head.

Though I do find the 'scoffed at rather than explained away' rather curious. That's a really skewed idea of burden of proof.

Aye aye, but I think when one doesn't actually study science, they're less familiar with an idea like burden of proof. It just feels like the theory is being laughed at and not looking into, that there are a few intrepid people actually looking for the truth. I don't think many of the people try and find out WHY scientists aren't taking the idea seriously, so they just go looking for ideas they think would be cool were they to exist.

Not sure how to avoid this problem really. Even if better communication were available, I'm not sure people would take advantage of it.

[GorkerMorker]

I think that if you're not familiar with science, it looks as if scientists are just sucking stuff out of their thumb and getting praised for it as well.

The only way to avoid this is simply good education. My favourite subject on high school was called 'general nature sciences' which was about science in general. It dealt with everything the other exact courses didn't touch upon IE all the cool stuff like space, history of science (+ stuff like pyramids and stone henge), history of technology, history of culture. But also on all the pseudosciences like astrology, new age, ufology etc. Not being disrespectful just showing the fundamental differences in their approach..

It was pretty funny because it was taught by our chemics teacher. I was the worst chemics students by far, but during GNS I was the best student by far. Something that kind of annoyed him somehow because for years he knew me as that idiot that couldn't do anything right.

I think that simply teaching kids from a young age about how the underlying mechanism of science works is much more useful for them than to teach them about all the facts that are a product of it (not saying that those aren't important). You can make it an incredibly fun course by incoorperating stuff from Carl Sagan, practical experiments, real life examples, news items, and even debates.

All high schools do is teach you facts while they never prevent you a proper framework to build upon. Such a general course would surely spark more interest in scientific studies and thus more exact students which is something the Western World has a huge shortage of.

Most of these conspiracy and pseudo-science people are no doubt very intelligent, they carefully find abstract patterns and connections. Imagine them using all that talent and creativity for things that actually matter.

[Caff]

it's coffee table, people are more attracted to easy studies with no real implication

The sort of stuff that'd be better used as a movie plot for example?

Cos when I read "coffee table" stuff that's all I'm thinking...hey this would make a great disaster/sci-fi film.

[GorkerMorker]

It's a form of escapism indeed. And it's a bit sad as well, if you have to play 'pretend' in order to make your life interesting enough, then you must be really bored out of your skull.

Here's a good one btw:

http://www.satansrapture.com/gen64.htm

[Sir Quinton]

I think it's more that Science is taught and talked about in such a boring way these days with needlessly stuffy language that's hard to connect with. It's all about what we do know rather than all the far more interesting stuff that we haven't got a clue about

You have to wade through all that until you can get to the really interestig stuff like what is time? Does the universe exist? And why is almost everything that exists based on Fibonacci numbers?

[Peroxide Pixie]

Why is this sort of junk-science so much more popular then proper science? That's what I'd like to know.




Do you think it is? Personally I love a good science documentary :)

[GorkerMorker]

Well I don't know the documentary you're talking about but from your description it honestly seems bogus. And it also depends on how the represent it. NG had a documentary on how extraterrestrial life would look like but they frequently added what was based on rigid facts and what was based on pure guess work and theorising.

[Dramatic Hammer]

Animals + navigation:
http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/08/thirdeyesteering/
http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/06/birdcompass/
http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/03/magneticcows/

[Peroxide Pixie]

Well I don't know the documentary you're talking about but from your description it honestly seems bogus. And it also depends on how the represent it. NG had a documentary on how extraterrestrial life would look like but they frequently added what was based on rigid facts and what was based on pure guess work and theorising.

My description seems bogus? I haven't described any documentaries I like :confused:

I think you may be getting a little confused with what I actually said, just because I've read some stuff on conspiracy theories doesn't mean to say I believe them.

[asotos]

Every date that someone said that end of world is coming:
31/12/999
20/2/1524
19/5/1719
1732
19/10/1814
3/4/1843
7/7/1843
21/3/1844
22/10/1844
2/10/1914
17/12/1919
24/5/1954
28/10/1992
7/1999
11/1999
31/12/1999

I guess that 21/12/2012 as some people believe, will be recorded in these dates.....

[GorkerMorker]

Yeah and if anything doesn't happen at exactly that date we will just pretend that nothing happened and that nobody predicted anything.